Looking for info on Homecooked Diets

[Dillydoodle]

Ok, all these recalls have me in a tizzy...today finding out that one of the Blue Buffalo brands (cat food) was recalled ,well that hit too close to home for me as my boys both are eating some canned blue buffalo mixed into their timberwolf dry food.. Additionally with the other info coming out in all these recalls , the fact that some of the brands with tainted ingredients did not list these ingredients on the actual bags makes me worry about what is or isnt really in the foods i am feeding to my dogs..

so in light of all this, i am looking to get information on some form of homecooked diets for dogs, I am NOT willing to take chances with raw meat- i don't fully buy into the fact that dogs can't get salmonella or other forms of food poisoning from raw foods... Does anyone have websites or info on whole food diets , cooking for your dogs, FULL suppliments to add to their diets to round out their home cooked diet? I will do my own research but know that there are others here who might have good information about this subject and could save me some leg work LOL ( yes i am thinking of you Cindy! LOL)

Emilie

[darci]

http://www.dogiebag.com/Recipes.php

http://www.api4animals.org/articles?p=360&more=1

http://www.dogaware.com/dogfeeding.html#Balance

http://b-naturals.com/Apr2006.php

http://www.monicasegal.com/







I am on Monica Segal's email list and she has given permission to cross post these recipes. Her recipes are balanced and I trust them more than any internet recipes that are floating around - she was very kind to do this!

Here is her post:
Although I receive a lot of private email every day, today's requests are heart
wrenching. Desperate to find a home-cooked diet to feed their dogs that were
kibble fed just a few days ago, people have been emailing all day. I can't keep
up with the emails, so maybe this can help. Please find below, two diets, one
for a healthy 20 pd dog and another for a healthy 50 pd dog. These go against my
fundamental belief that generic diets aren't a good choice, but due to the food
recall, just about anything is better than feeding an unknown.

These diets are cooked because that's what people have asked for. I don't have
anything against raw diets - just to make it clear :) Please understand that I
won't be tweaking the diets if your dog happens to weigh 60 pds or 8 pounds or
whatever. The booklets on my site would help most people much more than these
recipes, but these should help in the meantime.

I've taken into consideration that most kibble fed dogs, especially ones eating
foods containing wheat gluten, may have different food tolerances. I've also
considered that these dogs are accustomed to more carbohydrates in the diet than
what many of us feed. For these reasons, these recipes are *not* indicative of
my usual diets. They use ingredients contained in many pet foods and are
formulated to make an easier transition. They offer no variety, which is also
not the usual way I go about things. However, people are asking for the simplest
recipe possible, and I'm trying to honor the requests.

You may crosspost to other lists, if the list rules allow. My goal is to help
dog owners, so go ahead and post to your breed lists, breeder lists etc - but
please post this in it's entirety, or not at all.

Please note that I have no way of knowing what supplements someone may have
access to, or what those supplements may contain. For this reason, the
supplements in these recipes are ones from my site, however, I am not offering
these recipes in order to boost sales of my supplements. You can go to my site
to look at what a supplement provides and buy a product that's the same, or as
close as possible, from another source. Just be sure that you are not adding
more minerals, and that includes the iodine is various brands of kelp.

The amounts of foods and supplements are per day unless noted otherwise. The
weight/measure of a food is the *cooked* weight/measure, not raw. Where weight
is noted, use a kitchen scale, not cup measurements. Cups measure volume, not
weight,

For a 20 pd dog:

4 oz chicken dark meat with skin, stewed
1 oz beef liver - every 6 days
3/4 cup enriched egg noodles
1 TBS carrot (optional)
3/4 tsp bone meal
1/4 tsp. NoSalt (found in grocery stores next to table salt)
1/16 tsp kelp
5 mg zinc citrate or gluconate
2 capsules, vitamin E -- per week
500 mg wild salmon oil or flaxseed oil
1 3/4 capsules magnesium citrate
2 capsules, Multi Mineral Complex -- per week
1/2 tablet, vitamin B compound, per week*

* B vitamins are water soluble and excreted through urine. They should be
provided often, so feed 1/4 tablet twice weekly. Also, B vitamins can upset an
empty stomach. Always feed with food. Best bet: tuck it in a hand held piece of
food and feed as a treat.


For a 50 pound dog:

8 oz ground beef, lean, 15% fat
1/3 oz beef liver
7 oz brown rice (boiled as 1 part rice in 3 parts water until very, very soft)
1 oz zucchini
1/8 tsp NoSalt
1/8 tsp kelp
1 capsule, cod liver oil
1 3/4 tsp bone meal
2 capsules, Multi Mineral Complex -- per week
1 tablet, vitamin B compound -- every 2 weeks
2 capsules, vitamin E 200 IU -- per week

These diets meet 2006 NRC recommended allowances. Nutrient requirements are not
linear to body weight. That is, a 100 pound dog does not have the requirements
of a 10 pound dog multiplied by ten. So, these recipes would need tweaking to
suit the weight of dogs weighing more or less than noted, but they're a start.
Feed as required to maintain healthy weight - until you can change the diets to
a more suitable profile for an individual dog.

Monica Segal - AHCW
http://www.monicasegal.com
Author of: "K9Kitchen" and "Optimal Nutrition"
Seminars by Invitation: Email monica@...
Consultations ~ Diet Analyses ~ Quality-Tested Supplements

[Dillydoodle]

Thanks for posting all this info, i have started looking a few websites, one thing that surprised me is that they dont have blueberries or more green leafy veggies... no spirulina or other such nutrient rich forms of healthy algae... i look at the ingredient list on a bag of timberwolf and wonder how i could get all that good food into the right portions...

Also , didnt you post something from somewhere once that talked about pureeing all veggies so that dogs could gain the nutrients easier from them during digestion? Do you still have that link? Am i crazy to even consider cooking for Dillon and Gus myself? what about a mix of dry and homecooked? any thoughts... I have always been one to worry about making sure it is the optimal nutrition and worrying that i might not get the correct balance... any thoughts there? I really do want a debate here, in part to help me decide what i ought to do...and if anyone thinks doing this could be dangerous...

any thoughts or opinions on this subject would be appreciated ...
Thanks Cindy for all the great links.
Emilie

[darci]

Yeah you have to puree the veggies to break down the cell wall for them to use the nutrients.

I have been thinking of homecooking, its so scarey with the recalls. Its hard to trust any of the commerical companies.

I would contact a canine nutritionists to help me balance the diet. There are several books on the subject.


If it were me I would give kibble for one meal and home cook the 2cnd meal. Jmo...

[Dillydoodle]

Do you think such a drastic kind of change would give them terribly upset tummies ( remember, Dillon used to get the runs constantly until i started pumpkin in his diet... Where do you find a canine nutritionist? Just curious, why would you give kibble at one meal and home cook the second meal?
Emilie

[mtoy]

http://www.betterdogcare.com./consultations.html

I have heard very good things about this place. She does various levels of consulting and I believe one of the levels is half off because of the food recalls so she wants to help out. I haven't done it myself, but I'm thinking about it (along with a raw or cooked suplement for my dogs).

I think a combo of home cooked & kibble is a great way to go. In our hourse DH gets up very early and feeds Millie before going to work. He wants a neat and easy no-fuss meal for her, kibble is perfect. It's either me or my sone who does the afternoon feeding, and we have more time to find stuff in the fridge/freezer or cook, if necessary. You have the ultimate control in fixing your dogs' meals - which can be good or bad, actually, but hopefully good. At least you can personally inspect each and every ingredient.

Also, doing both kinds of foods keeps your dog used to kibble which is much easier when traveling or kenneling.

[dcole]

Emilie,

Thanks for starting this thread. Like you, this is hitting way too close to home for me. I feel that I have twice now dodged a bullet - once with Nutro Ultra canned and once with Natural Balance treats. Once these current small bags of Organix run out for Trevor and the kitties, I am switching to home cooked for everyone.

I have reserved a copy of Dr. Pitcairn's "Complete Guide to Natural Health for Dogs and Cats" at my local pet health food store. I am going to start with the recipes in his book. Although I understand that he is an advocate of raw diets, he also offers cooked recipes. Like you, I am not totally convinced that pets can't get salmonella or parasites from raw meat. I know that recently I did give Trevor a raw recreational bone, and although he totally enjoyed it, he had the runs big time early the next morning! So no raw for him. I am sure he will enjoy the home cooked meals (after all, he IS a corgi!). I just hope I can convince The Girls to eat it as well. :rolleyes:

[Dillydoodle]

I am going to see if i can find that book.. One of the things that concerned me about some of these recipes are that they dont include fruits or many veggies and i also wonder about suppliments to add to the foods... would missing link be a complete suppliment? or would it have to be used in conjunction with a pet tab or other vitamin pill? I just want to make sure that if i go and do this that my boys are being fed a Complete diet. I did get more timberwolf today for them , and got a few cans of the canidae lamb and rice, but still these manufactured foods leave me feeling a bit unsure... honestly after the whole venison being mixed with rice meal/gluten or whatever it was and NOT having that stated directly on the bag means you can't be certain that the ingredients you see on the bag are all you are actually getting in the food...

As for cats - I learned a lot about cats when Misty was diagnosed with diabetes. i have a site for you for switching them to all raw food ( or i am sure cooked would be fine too) and actually know more about cats eating raw diets and some really good raw diets completely grain free ( unlike dogs, cats are obligate carnivores and should not really be eating grains at all) Here is the website: http://catinfo.org

I have tried raw food diet for my cats about a year ago and one was interested the other two were not, it takes time and patience...

Emilie

[corgimom]

I am going to see if i can find that book.. One of the things that concerned me about some of these recipes are that they dont include fruits or many veggies and i also wonder about suppliments to add to the foods... would missing link be a complete suppliment? or would it have to be used in conjunction with a pet tab or other vitamin pill? I just want to make sure that if i go and do this that my boys are being fed a Complete diet. I did get more timberwolf today for them , and got a few cans of the canidae lamb and rice, but still these manufactured foods leave me feeling a bit unsure... honestly after the whole venison being mixed with rice meal/gluten or whatever it was and NOT having that stated directly on the bag means you can't be certain that the ingredients you see on the bag are all you are actually getting in the food...

As for cats - I learned a lot about cats when Misty was diagnosed with diabetes. i have a site for you for switching them to all raw food ( or i am sure cooked would be fine too) and actually know more about cats eating raw diets and some really good raw diets completely grain free ( unlike dogs, cats are obligate carnivores and should not really be eating grains at all) Here is the website: http://catinfo.org

I have tried raw food diet for my cats about a year ago and one was interested the other two were not, it takes time and patience...

Emilie

Really good link Emilie, thanks. I will be up late doing some reading:)

[dcole]

I'm picking up Dr. Pitcairn's book tomorrow during my lunch hour. One of his sample recipe's was buried in a link that Cindy gave:

http://www.dogaware.com/dogfeeding.html#Balance

Scroll down and click on the "Basic Recipe's for Dogs" link. He does say to add fresh vegetables and what he call's "Healthy powder" to the recipes - just a mixture of vitamins, calcium, etc. He also states you can just give a complete pet multi-vitamin.

I've also been giving Trevor and The Girls Solid Gold's Sea Meal with their meals - lots of good green foods, vitamins, minerals and enzymes in there. Trev has always had a nice coat, but I swear, since giving him the sea meal for about a month now, his coat feels like it has conditioner in it. :)

One thing to be aware of when purchasing the supplements for the "healthy powder" and taurine for the cats; many animal pharmaceuticals - and human ones, too! - come from China. :( So please read the labels!

[Dillydoodle]

I got to do some reading from that link and while it is a bit complex to get the mix right, i think if you were to make 4 different recipes all with varying proteins, veggies, etc and cook them all up in large batches and freeze them, you could really provide a good balanced diet. I am concerned if their tummies would adjust quickly or if they would get the runs for a longer time, especially as their diet would be ever changing ( different proteins, different veggies , different starches etc each day)...

Emilie

[mtoy]

Another way to go is to use a pre-mix like this one:
http://www.sojos.com/
and just add your own meat. Sounds expensive, but much easier than doing all the prep yourself, not to mention saving the freezer space (we are extremely challenged in the freezer real estate here). Of course, you are once again trusting yet another company to put quality ingredients into what you feed your dog. But at least it's not some huge corporation.

I don't know about anyone else, but I see the tv news people are catching on to our concern (finally). I've been seeing ads on every local channel about their upcoming coverage of home cooked and raw diets.